tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post5303445940958223058..comments2024-02-20T12:26:24.682-05:00Comments on language goes on holiday: Leather elbows on a tweed coat, oh is that the best you can do?Duncan Richterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-15707145405376252292013-04-01T10:55:45.795-04:002013-04-01T10:55:45.795-04:00Yes, there are battles worth fighting even if we l...Yes, there are battles worth fighting even if we lose, and with luck the good side will win in the end. I am always hopeful that right will win, especially in these matters where what is right actually is (as far as I can see) in everyone's self-interest. Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-10602059375946768352013-03-31T18:56:09.361-04:002013-03-31T18:56:09.361-04:00two thoughts the first is that many of those same ...two thoughts the first is that many of those same faculty have been justifying their work since at least the 80's as being a tool/methodology that their students can employ against various kinds of systemic pressure (even tyranny)on behalf of various humanist/democratic interests/causes and while they are likely wrong about the power/effectiveness of their teachings this seems to be put up or shut up times and second some fights are worth losing and than building upon over the long haul. <br />-dmfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-76988119762041268622013-03-31T13:28:13.485-04:002013-03-31T13:28:13.485-04:00That would be a shame, yes, but I don't know h...That would be a shame, yes, but I don't know how much tenured professors at non-elite schools can do. At least at my school we don't set the curriculum. The general political climate at non-elite schools is suggested by <a href="http://www.newappsblog.com/2013/03/remember-it-jake-even-if-it-is-louisiana.html" rel="nofollow">this story</a>. There Jeff Bell says: "The only way I see this changing is when the academic "stars" - who, along with state of the art gyms and dormitories, are still something administrators are dependent on and *may* listen to - join the struggle with adjuncts against university administrators." But there aren't a whole lot of academic stars at non-elite schools, and I would not assume that administrators would care very much what they thought. Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-80147326928554826562013-03-31T11:25:58.063-04:002013-03-31T11:25:58.063-04:00very good, I hope that tenured faculty at the many...very good, I hope that tenured faculty at the many non-elite schools will do something other than continue to wax nostalgic and write more sermons about the evils of neo-liberalism, it would be a shame on them if they leave the education process for the masses to the forces of the market.<br />-dmfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-59279146505649641142013-03-31T10:00:54.501-04:002013-03-31T10:00:54.501-04:00I'm fine with experimentation, as long as it d...I'm fine with experimentation, as long as it doesn't come at the cost of permanently abandoning the better for the worse. I.e. it's risky, and should be done cautiously. Part of the problem might be that so many people are going into higher education who really would be better off doing something else. That something else might what non-elite schools end up becoming. Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-5435453743603407922013-03-30T22:26:54.874-04:002013-03-30T22:26:54.874-04:00I think for people who have an 'ear' for s...I think for people who have an 'ear' for such things literature, poetry, history and such can certainly offer a variety of riches to add to our daily to and fro, and should be offered as such, but this won't be a primary concern/interest for most people. Folks like Donald Schon have pointed to the possibility of offering ways of fostering "reflective" practitioners of the various professions that are certainly worth further exploration/development but again won't likely be of direct use in training most people. As for the monetary value of higher ed. and general ed offerings I think that the trends for both of these are not very positive given the decline of many professions and the rise of focus on STEMS but time will tell. I don't think that we should throw away the whole project of the humanities but I do think we should reconsider whether a whole 4yr undergrad degree along such line is still the way to go or if something like conservatories for the gifted and continuing/adult ed for those who are just looking for enrichment aren't better paths, I think the more experimentation the better.<br />-dmfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-81894429814031457332013-03-30T20:14:20.237-04:002013-03-30T20:14:20.237-04:00Yes, I think you're right. There is work being...Yes, I think you're right. There is work being done on what improves critical thinking, but people mean different things by "critical thinking," and I doubt there would be much agreement about the value of any one conception over others. Faculty influence on the curriculum is roughly zero, as far as I can tell. And if people don't already see it as obvious that culture has value then perhaps that battle has already been lost. But a college degree still has monetary value, and general ed is not going to just disappear. At least not right away. So I think it's potentially useful to keep thinking about what it (along with the humanities) is for and how it should be done. Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-16429541285710343812013-03-30T18:12:51.450-04:002013-03-30T18:12:51.450-04:00having grown up a university brat (father dept. ch...having grown up a university brat (father dept. chair, mother a researcher turned dean) and having spent much of my adult life either directly in higher-ed and or in the company of college grads (many with grad degrees) I can honestly say that I see little to no evidence for people acting out anything like "critical" thinking in areas outside of their own limited technical fields (and even in them rarely do they venture out of their disciplined procedures) so when it comes to general ed for undergrads I think we need a new defense/justification, and certainly a more transparent sales-pitch to job-seekers&their parents, for higher ed that is tied into actual benefits/skills for post grad life. that said given the current market/political trends it may be too late for faculty led reform outside of a few well endowed strongholds and even there faculty influence is slipping and without better organizing by teachers we may be well into the move into tech-schooling/worker-payed-job-training for all....<br />-dmfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-40164458975092198852013-03-30T11:26:30.005-04:002013-03-30T11:26:30.005-04:00Thanks, Philip. I agree completely. A big part of ...Thanks, Philip. I agree completely. A big part of what I would like to see in some sort of critical thinking course, or series of courses, is something about the media and advertising. I just don't know if there's enough there to fill more than one course (if that). But, since I don't know, I can't confidently proclaim that there isn't enough.Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-4366394795104219312013-03-30T08:24:55.594-04:002013-03-30T08:24:55.594-04:00A couple of quick points.
First, re the Kulturkam...A couple of quick points.<br /><br />First, re the Kulturkampf Defence: I was actually paraphrasing (of all people) Richard Dawkins, who was himself quoting someone else. You can see Dawkins' comment here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysxG5jFeTME<br /><br />A less abrasive way of putting it would be to say I was using a "bedrock" argument. Justification comes to an end somewhere and it is a mistake (I believe) to think that humanities courses have to defend themselves in terms borrowed (knowingly or unknowingly) from science. At the end of the day we find history/literature/philosophy etc interesting and important. And that's that.<br /><br />Despite being a lit/phil graduate, I have some (limited) sympathy with calls to focus more on the study of mass communication in humanities courses. It is amazing how ignorant many people are of the techniques behind (eg) news reporting and advertising, and how vulnerable this makes them to manipulation. And even those of us who consider ourselves "informed" about these areas are probably manipulated more often than we'd care to admit. Understanding this phenomenon is probably an important part of living in the modern world.<br /><br />Of course "meeja studies" lacks the respectability of Eng Lit, but it's worth pointing out that Eng Lit was itself once the Media Studies of its day - ie, a course looked down on as being for duffers who weren't bright enough to study Classics or law.<br /><br />Finally, I share your concern about the way merging subjects entails a lack of depth. If it's any comfort, these things tend to go in cycles, especially regarding philosophy. So at some stage administrators decide it's useful to have philosophy attached to other subjects, then other administrators come along and say "why don't we gather all these philosophers together in one department?" and the whole thing starts again.Philip Cartwrighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11458571502536123264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-73762418649557521042013-03-29T20:49:30.251-04:002013-03-29T20:49:30.251-04:00Thanks. (Now that's how you tell someone to fu...Thanks. (Now that's how you tell someone to fuck off. I should take lessons.)<br /><br />Buell's work sounds good. It's partly trendiness that I fear, but all sorts of things that sound trendy can be done well. Relinquishment of the individual ego is good, preservation and conservation are good. Reverence, humility, responsibility, and care are all good. So I have no quarrel with this kind of thing. It's the apparently attention-seeking spirit in which these good things are sometimes promoted that bothers me. <i>That</i> can fuck off. (OK, that's probably my swearing limit reached for the year. Online anyway.) Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-33571199424054121132013-03-29T20:24:02.521-04:002013-03-29T20:24:02.521-04:00Almost certainly. I was jokily exaggerating my hos...Almost certainly. I was jokily exaggerating my hostility towards people who hold a view that I really do dislike. I meant something like: Well, then we'll just have to agree to disagree. But instead of saying that, I quoted Philip Cartwright's memorable "Kulturkampf Defense" of the humanities. Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-84669671963650251832013-03-29T19:20:44.151-04:002013-03-29T19:20:44.151-04:00"I don't usually swear at people I disagr..."I don't usually swear at people I disagree with, so that sort of is a joke."<br /><br />Is there a better term for this than "sort of a joke"? (Or: "If I were the sort of person who did usually swear at people I disagree with, I would at this point tell you to fuck off.")Matthew Pianaltohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16380038537888895216noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-55450136496896234872013-03-29T17:55:43.463-04:002013-03-29T17:55:43.463-04:00well if you don't really support telling peopl...well if you don't really support telling people to fuck off, then i tell you what, you can fuck off. for real!!<br /><br />duncan, who can say for sure, but i took the emphasis on environmental studies to be partly prompted by things like lawrence buell's work<br /><br />http://cla.calpoly.edu/~smarx/Nature/Buell.html<br /><br />which to the extent that it's been effective at doing what he sets out to do - reorient ways that they have in literary studies, american studies, etc. of thinking about verbal representations of human relationships to nature - could count as an argument that english for example needn't be replaced.j.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09002699528461726304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-21725874606224480332013-03-29T17:22:13.578-04:002013-03-29T17:22:13.578-04:00Right. I added that later thinking that I might ha...Right. I added that later thinking that I might have got carried away. I don't usually swear at people I disagree with, so that sort of is a joke. But the rest is meant seriously.Duncan Richterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15708344766825805406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6454161596094447448.post-44534710287975872322013-03-29T14:48:13.107-04:002013-03-29T14:48:13.107-04:00I don't think you need to say you are kidding ...I don't think you need to say you are kidding at the end. After all, at the end of the day, you aren't (right?).Matthew Pianaltohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16380038537888895216noreply@blogger.com